When is Williams Street going to show "To be or Nazi Be"?

[Chimera]

The majority of Adult Swim's viewers wouldn't care if Lupin dresses up like Hitler to fool an old Nazi, the show airs at 1:30am, and Family Guy got away with a few Hitler-based jokes. So why aren't they airing it? I know it was left off of the DVD because Pioneer was afraid that it would turn "potential buyers" away, and that they wanted Lupin to have a larger American audience before they allowed it to be seen, but isn't 6 months enough time for it to gather an audience? Why did they skip it again?

[Mugen]

The majority of Adult Swim's viewers wouldn't care if Lupin dresses up like Hitler to fool an old Nazi, the show airs at 1:30am, and Family Guy got away with a few Hitler-based jokes. So why aren't they airing it? I know it was left off of the DVD because Pioneer was afraid that it would turn "potential buyers" away, and that they wanted Lupin to have a larger American audience before they allowed it to be seen, but isn't 6 months enough time for it to gather an audience? Why did they skip it again?

Maybe it isn't dubbed yet, or it is dubbed and Pioneer is not giving the tape away.

[Ferquin]

For one reason or another, Pioneer isn't gonna release the episode, not even on DVD. Go figure. There's worse out there, but Pioneer isn't sure it's quite "ready" to release such an episode. Which of course is all a big load of crap, but hey, what're you gonna do?

Can someone sift through ANN's archives? I'm pretty sure that's where I read about this.

[RedTail]

It was Pioneer's decision not to release it. They feared that their launch of Lupin III wouldn't survive if they got bad press from that episode. They promised to dub it later "when the franchise is better established." I'd say it's about time...

- RedTail

[ClockStomper]

It was Pioneer's decision not to release it. They feared that their launch of Lupin III wouldn't survive if they got bad press from that episode. They promised to dub it later "when the franchise is better established." I'd say it's about time...

- RedTail

I thought the latest news was they aren't going to release it at all. Maybe I'm not remembering right?

[Arxane]

If Pioneer isn't going to release "To Be or Nazi Be" at all, then they have to explain leaving the episode's preview on the previouis episode.

[tigerrunner]

If Pioneer isn't going to release "To Be or Nazi Be" at all, then they have to explain leaving the episode's preview on the previouis episode.


Yeah, I agree. Besides, even if Pioneer DID release the episode, I still have doubts that WS would let it air. It's one of those things that would attract bad press to the block and Cartoon Network. Even if it doesn't offend a majority of Lupin viewers, it still would offend SOMEBODY(who will find out about the episode somehow), and if that somebody is, say, a soccer mom who, despite the fact that the block name is ADULT Swim, thinks that all programming on cartoon network is kiddie programming, well, there would be some serious consequences (of course, I know that I'm seriously exaggerating right now, but, crazier things have happened, I think).

[Master Moron]

I really doubt advertisers would pull their sponsorship of the show just because a few soccer moms complained, especially since their sponsors are aware that they're sponsoring programs geared towards adults. And if their sponsors did pull their ads, they could just find new sponsors...like Girls Gone Wild...

Besides, I don't think too many soccer moms are watching TV at 1:30 in the morning. And controversy would no doubt help Lupin's ratings.

[tigerrunner]

I really doubt advertisers would pull their sponsorship of the show just because a few soccer moms complained, especially since their sponsors are aware that they're sponsoring programs geared towards adults. And if their sponsors did pull their ads, they could just find new sponsors...like Girls Gone Wild...

Besides, I don't think too many soccer moms are watching TV at 1:30 in the morning. And controversy would no doubt help Lupin's ratings.

OK, so I admit soccer moms was an exaggeration, but things like this could travel through word of mouth, or some other person watching the show might be offended. And I know just a few complaints would change nothing, but if it got some media attention, well, that's another story.

And if WS won't allow beer companies (or any other alcoholic beverage company) to sponsor their programming, what makes you think they'd want Girls Gone Wild's sponsorship? Even if all of their other sposors pulled their ads, I doubt WS would have a change of heart and air ads like that.

[Sigma]

Im sure they will eventually show it. If they are going to show the banned episode of Family Guy then I don't see why the wouldn't show an episode of Lupin with Nazi's.

[ClockStomper]

Im sure they will eventually show it. If they are going to show the banned episode of Family Guy then I don't see why the wouldn't show an episode of Lupin with Nazi's.

FOX banned the episode, it may be no different than any other Family Guy episode for all we know. FOX's decisions make no sense. And you seem misinformed. CN never got the chance to approve or reject the Nazi episode since it was never dubbed. Pioneer dosen't want to dub it for it's own reasons. Since it's a DVD release, advertisers aren't a concern.

[Stev13_VJED]

What's really ironic and stupid on Pioneer and AS's part is that they allowed Hell Toupee to be shown and yes I know it was shown as Lupin and Fujicakes fighting off the nazi horde , but still Nazi's were there joke's were made both subtle and up front so then why can't "To Be Or Nazi Be " I always wondered why they jumped from "Buns , Guns , and Fun In The Sun " to "50 ways to leave your 50 foot lover " . I guess both Pioneer and AS have their own PC's and PC's tick me off .

[Animation Otaku]

They weren't Nazi's. They were a fanatic group lead by someone named 'Hutler' that had a symbol similar to the swastika.

:p

[Stev13_VJED]

If it looks like a nazi , quacks like a nazi , and acts like a nazi , well you get my point . It is true that it wasn't the orginal Nazi's per say , but thats like saying N'Sync isn't like O-Town or all the rest of those cookie-cutter groups simply because it doesn't share the same name or whatever small detail may somewhat distinguish said group . There were enough instances and subtle hints in Hell Toupee to give me the impression that the fanatical "german" group had in fact been nazi's I mean come on man .

[Animation Otaku]

But because they weren't actually Nazi's I don't think that AS or Pioneer could get in trouble for it.

[Stev13_VJED]

Touche my freind you have won our discussion .

[saladdays]

For one reason or another, Pioneer isn't gonna release the episode, not even on DVD. Go figure. There's worse out there, but Pioneer isn't sure it's quite "ready" to release such an episode. Which of course is all a big load of crap, but hey, what're you gonna do?

Can someone sift through ANN's archives? I'm pretty sure that's where I read about this.

I'm pretty sure that Pioneer said they would release the episode at different time. Have they said differently or implied differently?

[saladdays]

Yeah, I agree. Besides, even if Pioneer DID release the episode, I still have doubts that WS would let it air. It's one of those things that would attract bad press to the block and Cartoon Network. Even if it doesn't offend a majority of Lupin viewers, it still would offend SOMEBODY(who will find out about the episode somehow), and if that somebody is, say, a soccer mom who, despite the fact that the block name is ADULT Swim, thinks that all programming on cartoon network is kiddie programming, well, there would be some serious consequences (of course, I know that I'm seriously exaggerating right now, but, crazier things have happened, I think).

I think people tend to use the term "soccer mom" around here to freely. I mean, everytime there is any type of discussion/debate about censorship or anything even remotely related to it there is at least someone who uses this term. Just because someone doesn't realize that there are shows on CN that aren't for kids, doesn't make that person a "soccer mom." And no, not everyone knows that there is a block of programs called Adult Swim. I'm beginning to think that there are too many definitions of "soccer mom" being used on this forum.

[Proteus3]

I'm pretty sure that Pioneer said they would release the episode at different time. Have they said differently or implied differently?

That is what I heard also. Unless there is more recent news about this, Pioneer's letter that came before the DVD release stated that they would release the episode on one of the later DVDs. I don't know if they ever plan to give it to Cartoon Network, but I doubt it. If there was more recent news that stated that they wouldn't be releasing "To Be or Nazi Be" at all, please post it. I couldn't find any news of it at ANN, but their archives seem to be incomplete.

Edit: Here (http://www.animenation.net/news/index.php?id=4251) is the news report at AN. It states that the "To Be or Nazi Be" will be released on a later volume. I couldn't find any more recent news that contradicts this.

[RedTail]

And if WS won't allow beer companies (or any other alcoholic beverage company) to sponsor their programming, what makes you think they'd want Girls Gone Wild's sponsorship? Even if all of their other sposors pulled their ads, I doubt WS would have a change of heart and air ads like that.

The guy was joking about GGW... Even if for some reason they happened to lose some of their adult sponsors for some stupid reason, there's always someone out there willing to take their place.

But because they weren't actually Nazi's I don't think that AS or Pioneer could get in trouble for it.

I have a feeling that had this been an earlier episode, it may have fell victim to the same fate as "To Be or Nazi Be." Like Pioneer said, they wanted to make sure the franchise didn't get negative press on its launch. I don't think the fear was well founded, but I don't think they were lying either.

- RedTail

[Mog]

If it looks like a nazi , quacks like a nazi , and acts like a nazi , well you get my point . It is true that it wasn't the orginal Nazi's per say , but thats like saying N'Sync isn't like O-Town or all the rest of those cookie-cutter groups simply because it doesn't share the same name or whatever small detail may somewhat distinguish said group . There were enough instances and subtle hints in Hell Toupee to give me the impression that the fanatical "german" group had in fact been nazi's I mean come on man .

Contradict. Look it up.

[TODE]

If Pioneer isn't going to release "To Be or Nazi Be" at all, then they have to explain leaving the episode's preview on the previouis episode.They left off the preview for it off the DVD release.

[Dogasu]

Yeah, I agree. Besides, even if Pioneer DID release the episode, I still have doubts that WS would let it air. It's one of those things that would attract bad press to the block and Cartoon Network. Even if it doesn't offend a majority of Lupin viewers, it still would offend SOMEBODY(who will find out about the episode somehow), and if that somebody is, say, a soccer mom who, despite the fact that the block name is ADULT Swim, thinks that all programming on cartoon network is kiddie programming, well, there would be some serious consequences (of course, I know that I'm seriously exaggerating right now, but, crazier things have happened, I think).

CN aired the episode of Toonheads dealing with World War II, which included a Daffy Duck short with swastikas showing all over the place. And they got praise for it.

The Justice League episodes "Injustice for All" (I think that's the title...haven't seen too many episodes of the show myself) had a villain who, while not Nazi, was obviously inspired by the Nazis. It's rerun by the network constantly.

Episodes of Family Guy and an episode of Futurama had jokes about Hitler, and they were all kept intact.

CN is going to air the episode of Family Guy that got banned by Fox for having too many anti-Jewish jokes.

AND, CN aired the preview for "To Be or Nazi Be" when that same preview wasn't included on the DVD. I think they've since put the preview for Episode 4 at the end of Episode 2 to cover up the fact that an episode was skipped, though.

So I don't think CN has any problem whatsoever with airing the episode. It's just that Pioneer won't give it to them. I'm sure they realize that, having the show on at 1:30 am with no advertising on the network before 10pm, that few parents will find out about one episode featuring Nazis. Or, if the parents do find out about it, that they realize that the show is on at a time that no kid is going to find it. From what I gather, the episode features Lupin dressed up as Hitler and pretty much making a caricature of him (similar to the Hitler in the Daffy Duck short that aired on Toonheads), so I'm not sure who's supposed to be offended by the episode in the first place. Nazi sympathisers? People against the stereotyping of the most hated men in history?

Humorous side note: I was doing a project on German TV for my German class last semester, and while researching I found out that Lupin III aired on the German MTV (go to http://www.mtv.de/lupin/index.php?historie=,,,Home,MTV+Shows&groupie=4& for more). What's interesting is that they're not airing any episodes of the Pioneer-released TV series--instead, they're airing the FUNimation-released TV Specials/Movies by chopping them up into 30-minute episodes (like what CN did with the Dragon Ball Z movies a few years ago). Anyway, among the movies being played is "The Pursuit of Harimao's Treasure," a TV Special (or is it a movie? Different websites say different things) that features a bunch of Neo-Nazis as villains (in fact, the main villain is a cross-dressing Nazi named "Herr Maffroditte" :D ). Don't you think it's funny that we have a company here fretting over a silly Hitler caricature in a not well-known anime while the country you'd think would have the biggest problem with it airs a Nazi-heavy movie at 10:30 pm Wednesday nights?

[SpaceCowboy]

"To Be Or Nazi Be" does feature the actual Hitler, so it's pretty understandable why Pioneer pulled it. If given to CN, they'd probably ban it.

How many animated shows on American TV have you seen feature the actual Hitler as the center of the episode?

[Ben]

I think they've since put the preview for Episode 4 at the end of Episode 2 to cover up the fact that an episode was skipped, though.

Actually I saw that preview very recently (as in a few weeks ago) so they haven't dumped it yet.

[Animation Otaku]

The last time episode 2 aired was just 3 days ago, and they had the preview for episode 3.

[Duelist]

Um guys, I distinctly remember them showing an episode with Hitler/Nazis in it (they escaped from the castle in a balloon with hitler's face in it cause they can't deface something in his likeness...)

THEY DID SHOW IT...WITH THE NEW EPISODES

[Animation Otaku]

That was a different episode. And it wasn't Hitler, it was a guy named 'Hutler' who lead a group of Nazi-like fanatics with a swastika-like party symbol.

[Matt Hazuda]

Um guys, I distinctly remember them showing an episode with Hitler/Nazis in it (they escaped from the castle in a balloon with hitler's face in it cause they can't deface something in his likeness...)

THEY DID SHOW IT...WITH THE NEW EPISODES...
That was Hell Toupee, as was already stated DG
Step 1: Insert foot into mouth.

[Duelist]

...
That was Hell Toupee, as was already stated DG
Step 1: Insert foot into mouth.


err...oops?

[Lupin the Wolf]

To reiterate what has been been stated on this subject in the past countless times:

-The "Hitler" episode is Episode 3, "To Be or Nazi Be," the literal Japanese title translation being "Hitler's Legacy." There was another episode within the first "season" ("Hell Toupee") where "Hatler" and his militant regime attack Lupin when he steals Hatler's toupee while attempting to collect the gemstone on his chest. The episodes were originally written by two different individuals.
-The "Hell Toupee" episode showed "Hatler" as little more than a bumbling idiot.
-*Pioneer* is the company who was concerned about the airing of "To Be or Nazi Be," NOT CARTOON NETWORK. They removed the episode from its proper order of both broadcast and video release. However, Pioneer did state that they would release the episode at a later time (more specifically, "when the franchise had been established").
-The concern Pioneer has since voiced regarding the "Hitler" episode is that the story, by the time it reaches its conclusion, "portrays Hitler in a sympathetic light." If "Hell Toupee" had done so (and it comes nowhere near such a thing), it likely would have been eligible for delayed release, as well.

Did I miss anything, here?

[Master Moron]

I had no idea that the "To Be or Nazi Be" portrayed Hitler in a sympathetic light. In that case, it probably would cause controversy, and in that case I want to see it more. I'm not really much of a Lupin fan but this episode has me extremely intrigued.

[Chimera]

I'm starting to suspect that Pioneer is delaying the release of this episode longer than what's necessary (if it was even necessary in the first place) so they can release a special-edition Lupin III volume one DVD with the PREVIOUSELY BANNED BECAUSE "THEY" DON'T WANT YOU TO SEE IT / YOU ARE THE ONLY ONE WHO GETS TO SEE IT SINCE YOU BOUGHT THE DVD episode. If they had released it on the first DVD then there wouldn't have been this much excitement about it.

[Master Moron]

You know now that I think about it, didn't Pioneer say that there was another episode that they were going to cut from the DVDs?

[Lupin the Wolf]

You know now that I think about it, didn't Pioneer say that there was another episode that they were going to cut from the DVDs?

No, they did not.

And they never said any episode would be "cut" to begin with. Only "delayed."