child-parent relationship...where to draw the lines

[DisneyBoy]

I wanted to discuss something that has been coming up quite a bit in my relationship with my parents. I live with them and love them dearly, but things have been off for quite a while. To them, I appear lazy (leaving a bit of a mess in my room), controlling (I like to tape two or three shows a season...this drives them nuts), stubborn (I refuse to "let things go", needing apologies to be exchanged before moving beyond an issue or argument) and rebellious (I question any punishments or comments I deem unjust and always voice my opinions, even if they don't like them).

From my point of view, they expect to be treated as authoritative figures rather than people (they prefer me to do as I'm told, rather than do something out of the goodness of my own heart), are judgemental (they call me a dreamer, a loser and worst of all, a "hormonal, troubled teenager") and are unwilling to change (I'm always at fault, and I'm always the one who is supposed to alter my behaviors and attitude).

How do you feel things should be between parents and children? Is it wiser to simply do what you're told, no questions asked, than debate or challenge opinions and ideas that you don't agree with? Should parents never waver in their love for their offspring, or do they have every right to throw them out of their house, and out of their lives? For people in difficult family situations, is it wiser to move out for a while, or stay and try to overcome the obstacles? Also, should family members stay out of arguments that don't involve them specifically, or is anything that happens in the home up for discussion? Do people swear in your home? Does everything in the house "belong to your parents" or is everyone's property respected as being their own, regardless of who payed for it (referring to bedroom furniture, clothes and gifts)?

I realize how lucky I and most of us are. I'm not trying to say that every argument is worth destroying a relationship over...but where do you draw the lines?

[bfmusashi]

As far as parents go, it is sometimes better to simply do as you're told, even if it may seem unfair or annoying. Parents, despite the low amount of credit that's given to them, have been around for longer than their offspring, and this gives them more experience in most matters. They're usually right when it comes to things, and in these instances, it's better to listen to them. Of course, I don't believe that a person should totally let his or her parents control every decision and action they make. A person should respect and listen to their parents, but they shouldn't let their parents dominate their lives.

Moving on to another subject, I personally think it's terribly heartless and horrible for a parent to even consider throwing one of their children out of their house. I believe that once parents have children, it is their own personal responsibility to care for and protect those children. Neglecting or throwing their children out of their lives is a violation of that responsibility, and no child should have to grow up with that.

[JustJack]

I ate my parents....I told them I'd shoot! But the didn't believe me..WHY DIDN'T THEY BELIEVE ME?!?!

Haha, but really....here's how my house rules work. My parents trust me to never do drugs or get drunk, and I can do pretty much whatever I want, wherever, whenever. Just as long as I am not drunk. And I don't get drunk, and I've never done drugs. They have no reason to not trust me, and I don't want to break that trust. So...I can do whatever I want.

My life rocks...huh? :cool:

[gtracer72]

Since I am 19, my parents have let go the reins. They still trust me to think things through. However, I still listen to them for advice, after all, they have been around longer.

Keep in mind to, that it is their house, and that you are living in their house. Therefore, you should abide by their rules.

[DisneyBoy]

How have differenciating view points been dealt with in your family? Whose decision is it?

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

As long as you're eating their food and living in their house, I wouldn't disagree or criticize them too often. They always wave the "You wanna get kicked out of the house?" conversation-ender in front of me when I've got them cornered in an argument. I almost did get kicked out a few weeks ago because of a confrontation with my Dad (even though we live in the same house, we are not close).

Even when your parents are clearly wrong about something, you just have to bite your pride and tongue and go along with them. He who holds the money, holds the power. It's true. Democracy is not yet a common household practice. I have vowed to change this when I have my own family.

I think the older you get, the more you should start thinking about getting a stable job and moving out. Every parent doesn't want their child living with them until they're 35. I intend to leave the roost in my mid 20s, but of course, actions speak louder than words.

[gtracer72]

Originally posted by DisneyBoy
How have differenciating view points been dealt with in your family? Whose decision is it?

Our differing views are never really settled. We just argue until we get tired, or until I prove them wrong :) . In the end, I just retreat back down to the basement where I live. The thing is, I really don't spend much time with them. The most time I do is when dinner is ready, otherwise, I'm at school or downstairs.

Like Larry said, sometimes you just have to bite your pride and tongue and go along with it. I know I won't be outta of this house until I get a B.S. degree. Then I'll get out.

[Sandro]

While parents may act like fascist dictators at times, they've been around longer so they most likely know what they are talking about.

[James]

Again, a reason why I thought there should be an educational system for parents. There are certain rules and methods to bringing up children. Nothing is carte blanche, but some basic principles that are used from the start will make a relationship easier.

Mothers/Fathers who complain that they have to feed their kids sweets because they won't eat their meals... don't make you kid eat his meal, don't feed him sweets when he is hungry he'll eat.

When there is a teenage issue how to respond. If you don't like the boyfriend/girlfriend, don't ground the kid or ban them from seeing the spouse, don't get involved as the kid will probably find solice in any issue you make with the hated boy/girlfriend.

My point is that as kids grow up, they are going through changes and experiences for which they have no experience of. It's up to the parent to learn where to draw lines which are fair, make sense and help guide - even through a little manipulation - their kid down the hard road.

If the parent's been there before, it seems all to easy to forget. I put the main responisibilty on the parent. If they do their job, put the kid first, listen to the kid, remember what it was like to be a kid, and follow some basic logical and psychological rules I think the kid will respond to the 'line' wit a positive attitude.

[Pilmedium]

Originally posted by DisneyBoy
How do you feel things should be between parents and children? Is it wiser to simply do what you're told, no questions asked, than debate or challenge opinions and ideas that you don't agree with?

I think it is better to question parents when events seem unfair. If they get angry, it is their problem.

[Barb Gordon]

There are some parents who don't deserve the respect on their children, and there are certainly some children that no parent should have to put up with. But most parents are good parents, and most kids are good kids. My parents have raised my older sis and I incredibly well. We fault, yes, argue, of course who doesn't, but in general we respect our parents, and they respect us......and my mom likes to talk about how great we are, and all her friends love us and their children glare at us :rolleyes:. My mom and I hang out a lot, and really when I think about it, I have no grounds to EVER argue with her, get her angry, or not do something she says. But I'm human, I make mistakes....boy do I make mistakes. My mom has always allowed me to do and try anything I wanted, drive me everywhere, by me anything, and although I do immensely appreciate that, sometimes the spoiled brat bug gets into me and I really start taking her for granted, talking back and well..acting like a teenager *shudders*. But life is full of mistakes, and my parents certainly are at fault sometimes. Whether they admit it or not, which they usually do, they are at fault sometimes in our arguments, and they've actually apologized to either my sister or I. There has to be a healthy balance between the respect the parent and child deserves and should get. As a growing adult with thoughts of my own and my own personality, I'm entitled to deserve some respect from my parents, which I'm given most all the time. In turn, my parents have raised me well, I live under their roof, eat their food, they bought me my car, the list goes on, and they deserve the utmost respect from me...even if it's not always given. I've tried from time to time to perhaps argue a point, sometimes I'm right, other times I'm wrong, but I never regretted trying to counter an argument. And the older I get, the more responsibility my parents will lrt me handle on my own, which I love having, but I admit there have been times when I've asked my mom or dad for help in some area when I knew I was way in over my head.

A parent needs to love their children. They brought them into this world, and it's their responsibility to provide for them and raise them. Some parents quite literally suck at this and should never ever be parents. And where the line should be drawn is going to be extremally different for every family. But I would think that most of us here have relatively all around good parents who deserve to be treated with some amount of respect, and in turn, I'm assuming we're all mostly good kids here, we should have earned some respect in return/

~Barb

[Weatherman]

Parenting classes. Not a bad idea SSJ, but goos luck ever getting anything of the sort written into the books on this side of the Pond.

My parents and I have arguments, usually really small about once a day, but we always make amends for what happens and move along. Things have been rather hectic around here and everyone's a tad razzled. But we still love and respect one another as parent-child, sibling-sibling. You get the idea. I am eternally grateful for everything my parents have done for me and for what they let me do. I can only hope I can do somewhere near as good a job if and when I have kids as my parents have done for me.

[hello_lola]

Just do what they say - it will save you a lot of guilt, grief and embarassment when you're older.

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

Originally posted by Pilmedium


I think it is better to question parents when events seem unfair. If they get angry, it is their problem.

It will be your problem if they decide they've had enough of you "not respecting" them.

Some parents simply do not listen to reason. They have a tunnel-vision where even conciliatory responses can have no effect. A lot of parents have a "My house, my roof, my rules" mentality that they learned from their own sad childhood. Even worse are those parents who change their rules to suit their own needs, but only apply them when it's concerning someone else in the family.

The same childish behaviour could be said for children, as well.

I can't say I agree with my parents' tactics all the time. Sometimes I respect the intent, but sometimes they are purely emotive rather than logical.

I suppose some parents think that giving you food and shelter is basically all that a parent has to do to be a good parent, and some parents expect some kind of "reward" from their children for that. I don't think that is necessarily right. Children respect parents when parents treat them with a degree of respect, dignity and intelligence--I think some parents fail to realize this. A lot of them don't realize that self-respect is just as important to children as it is to parents. If you don't have a system of relative equality concerning duties in the household, there won't be a lot of respect going around. Ordering a child to wash a mess YOU made is demeaning and and disrespectful to the child's ego. Yet this happens in many households.

And for the love of Gawd, parents, don't throw childish dish-throwing temper tandrums. Nothing kills respect like idiotic non-abuse temper tandrums which serve no purpose other than wreck precious household items. Scream and yell if you must, but once you break something, don't expect the child to forget it. And if you resort to abuse, well, that's for another thread...

I would say I grew up in a reasonable household (nothing illegal like child abuse or anything like that... :rolleyes: ), but it is probably not a "good" one like most others here. I would say my relationship with one of them is borderline respectfully chilly at best--and probably always will be--and I really only truly respect my other one, whom I argue with a lot but don't mind conceding to on issues since there is more "give and take" going on.

So this is one perspective from a "not really normal" parent-child relationship.

[DisneyBoy]

Babs Gordon, I realy enjoyed your words on the subject. Well said. I would also like to offer my deepest sympathies to you, Leaping Larry Jojo, because it must hurt to know that your relationship with your parents isn't likely to improve. I've been holding out with that hope for years. It's starting to reach a point where I think they prefer to be angry with me, because it requires less work than sitting down, taking responsibility and figuring out a way to move beyond the problems that continuously plague us. No matter what good I do, they choose to stick their fingers in their ears and their hands over their eyes and scream "HORMONAL TEENAGER". I'm a good person, and frankly, I'm tired of tolerating verbal abuse from my parents.

[Weatherman]

DB, have you tried talking to any of your relatives about this? Maybe your grandparets and/or uncles/aunts might be able to convice your parents to back down a bit. Best of luck to you.

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

Originally posted by DisneyBoy
Babs Gordon, I realy enjoyed your words on the subject. Well said. I would also like to offer my deepest sympathies to you, Leaping Larry Jojo, because it must hurt to know that your relationship with your parents isn't likely to improve. I've been holding out with that hope for years. It's starting to reach a point where I think they prefer to be angry with me, because it requires less work than sitting down, taking responsibility and figuring out a way to move beyond the problems that continuously plague us. No matter what good I do, they choose to stick their fingers in their ears and their hands over their eyes and scream "HORMONAL TEENAGER". I'm a good person, and frankly, I'm tired of tolerating verbal abuse from my parents.

Well, it doesn't really hurt since I do have love and support from other family members, but since I was born, it's always felt like I've had one parent all my life, with the other being more of a distant uncle or something. When you live your whole life like that, it doesn't so much hurt as just make you sigh and move on. I can't say I've had it bad. I've lived comfortably for the most part, and I have had freedom to do what I want, and develop independent thought. I do talk to both of my parents, so it's not like a strangers relationship, it's just that when it ultimately counted, only one of them has been there for me during the thick and thin.

It's a give and take thing. If you see your parents work hard and at least try to help you, you can swallow some of their verbal abuse. But parents who do nothing in your life but "tolerate" you, well, that's a little harder to take verbal criticism from.

[Pilmedium]

Originally posted by Leaping Larry Jojo
It will be your problem if they decide they've had enough of you "not respecting" them.

It's not that I don't respect my parents. It is that I do not think they should be treated like king and queen. There is a problem with that about 1 in 100 times. They knew not to put their children through the same misery they once put up with.

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

Originally posted by Pilmedium


It's not that I don't respect my parents. It is that I do not think they should be treated like king and queen. There is a problem with that about 1 in 100 times. They knew not to put their children through the same misery they once put up with.

Not all the parents are the same, is what I mean. Say the wrong thing, and some parents can very well toss you out of the house, whether you can support yourself or not.

I have a lot of things to say to them, but some of it will have to wait until I've moved out and can support myself.

[Pilmedium]

Originally posted by Leaping Larry Jojo
Not all the parents are the same, is what I mean. Say the wrong thing, and some parents can very well toss you out of the house, whether you can support yourself or not.

A sibling I have was sent to live somewhere else for at least 5 days weekly, due to behavior. However, that person caused trouble often multiple times daily, while I have a problem usually 2 times per month.

[Barb Gordon]

Thanks DisneyBoy! I was afraid I had just posted some very confusing ramblings that only I got. Another step concerning this parent/child relationship and where to draw the line, do you think having siblings affects this at all? If you're an older or younger kid in the family, perhaps you can or cannot get away with a lot of things compared to your brothers and/or sisters? It might be really interesting to see if having siblings makes a difference in the relationships with our parents.

~Barb

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

Originally posted by Pilmedium


A sibling I have was sent to live somewhere else for at least 5 days weekly, due to behavior. However, that person caused trouble often multiple times daily, while I have a problem usually 2 times per month.

You assume that all parents are acting in a disciplinary manner. Some parents tolerate no conversation, no talkback, and when I mean "toss out", I really mean "toss out." Not "sent to live somewhere else" but, "get out the door and go live in a cardboard box." But if you do what you're told, you stay. It's tantamount to blackmail, and that isn't teaching anything. That's how a lot of street kids end up in the streets--a bad relationship with their parents, who probably shouldn't even be parents if they can't make the effort to consider the child's self-respect. I don't mean spoil them--I don't believe in spoiling a child--but have reasons for what you order them to do. Telling a kid to do something just because it gives you a power trip is IMO, despicable.

IMO, these parents deserve the cold shoulder they get from their children when they are older.

[DisneyBoy]

Barb, you bring up an interesting point. I have an older sister, who, as of a few years ago, used to be the one getting all the flack from my parents, despite being generally good. I can still recall my mother telling me in the car "I hope you aren't a teenager like your sister" and I promised to never be a "teenager"...in the stereotypical sense of the word. To me, it represented unfounded protests of agression and rebellion, brought on my a general dissatisfaction with the world. There was no way I'd ever become the source of my parent's scorn.

Years later, I feel as if I'll never be anything but. I've put so much into fixing our now-stressful household, earning nothing more than the occasional compliment, followed up with yelling. The minute I approach them to "speak with you about something" they throw their eyes to the sky and give each other a look - here he goes again. To make matters worse, my older sister isn't even a topic of discussion. I think I can name four arguments they've had with her this year. I am now the "bad child" and she has quite literally joined up with them - something I never did...I knew when to stay out of things as a child - whenever they are displeased with me. She really doesn't care if she the subject has anything to do with her. I can bearly get a word in edgewise while the three of them begin to escalate the situation with their anger and predicitons. I'm almost glad I she's never really around the house, because whenever she senses a good argument, she jumps right in...with no intent to help the situation.

It's all so frustrating. I'm finally beginning to realize that my parents aren't willing to see things in a new light..so why bother trying to cinvince them?

They regard me as the troublesome one everytime I walk into a room. It's really awful waking up to that.