Why doesn't CN just make more cartoons aimed at the 9-14 crowd?

[The Overlord]

One of the reasons behind the creation of CN: Real, was CN wanted to reach out more to the 9-14 crowd. Considering the two biggest shows on CN at the moment are PG rated toons aimed at the 9-14 crowd, why don't they just make more shows like that?

That seems like less of risk then these crappy reality show knocks they intend to air.

[The Huntsman]

I’m not sure if they’ll be PG, but the network is trying to do just that. Several “Cartoonstitute” shorts were rejected for being “too young”, and from what has been revealed about “Generator Rex” and “Sym-Bionic Titan”, young kids don’t seem to be their target demographic.

[The Overlord]

I’m not sure if they’ll be PG, but the network is trying to do just that. Several “Cartoonstitute” shorts were rejected for being “too young”, and from what has been revealed about “Generator Rex” and “Sym-Bionic Titan”, young kids don’t seem to be their target demographic.

See I'm not sure why don't do what Canadian animators do in order to create cartoons that appeal to pre-teens.

The people from Fresh Entertainment personally perform Market research, they just go to Eaton's Center and ask pre-teens what they like or just observe their behavior and then put those elements in their shows.

That makes more sense then assuming they will like survivor Jr.

[Dr.Pepper]

Well I know that they are doing the reality series to get some money, but they will be making more cartoons for older kids.

[Jeff Harris]

Well I know that they are doing the reality series to get some money.Psst . . . they're doing everything they've ever done to get money. Otherwise, they'd be giving away their DVDs and air their shows commercial-free. Pass it on.

[Raidon Makoto]

Because that would be too easy and not stupidly risky enough. :P

[ChadThompson]

They picked up Chaotic's 2nd season and Yu-Gi-Oh! 5D's which could both be considered within the 9-14 age range, and their shows like the new Batman series and The Clone Wars are definatly aimed at the older crowd, and from what Huntsman said in his post it looks like more shows are on the way.

[The Overlord]

They picked up Chaotic's 2nd season and Yu-Gi-Oh! 5D's which could both be considered within the 9-14 age range, and their shows like the new Batman series and The Clone Wars are definatly aimed at the older crowd, and from what Huntsman said in his post it looks like more shows are on the way.

It might be hard to sell cartoons where card games are considered the most important thing ever to tweens, when I was 13, I wouldn't like such a show.

[ChadThompson]

It might be hard to sell cartoons where card games are considered the most important thing ever to tweens, when I was 13, I wouldn't like such a show.

I don't know many people who are younger than the 9-14 age range playing and understanding these complex card games that are out on the market, when I was in highschool I couldn't even understand how to play Magic the Gathering, so I would say that Chaotic and Yu-Gi-Oh! are aimed at a slightly older audience than say a Skunk Fu or George of the Jungle.

[Jeff Harris]

It might be hard to sell cartoons where card games are considered the most important thing ever to tweens, when I was 13, I wouldn't like such a show.My little cousin is a great barometer of things for that elusive tween demographic. He's 12. He thinks it's stupid that Cartoon Network is airing live-action ("Because they're Cartoon Network," he tells me). He's not a fan of those card/game based cartoons, but he likes cartoons like Chowder, Flapjack, Spongebob Squarepants, and 6Teen. Not to mention he's a wrestling fanatic. He doesn't like Hannah Montana nor much of anything on The Disney Channel but he likes iCarly because he thinks Miranda Cosgrove is cute . . . whoever she is. And who the heck is True Jackson, because he thinks she's cute too?

Like I said, he's a good barometer of what the tweens like because, um, he's a tween.

[The Overlord]

I don't know many people who are younger than the 9-14 age range playing and understanding these complex card games that are out on the market, when I was in highschool I couldn't even understand how to play Magic the Gathering, so I would say that Chaotic and Yu-Gi-Oh! are aimed at a slightly older audience than say a Skunk Fu or George of the Jungle.

The problem is those shows are about as subtle as a sledge hammer, they are so product driven its hard not roll your eyes. I think you have to be a little more sly when aiming something at a tween.

[Dr.Pepper]

Psst . . . they're doing everything they've ever done to get money. Otherwise, they'd be giving away their DVDs and air their shows commercial-free. Pass it on.
I mean to get more money, since its cheaper to make some reality series than it is to make a cartoon.

[Jeff Harris]

I mean to get more money, since its cheaper to make some reality series than it is to make a cartoon.Yeah . . . and it took them 18 years to get to that point? Talk about slow learners.

No, that's not it. I mean, yeah, spending a huge chunk of the acquisition money on Star Wars was bad enough.

I think a lot of people are giving them way too much slack and overlooking the fact that an animation network is pushing live-action as if it's the answer to their ratings woes, and if that mentality becomes accepted (and these live-action shows are hits), then they're not going to spend whatever monies they earn on more animation.

They're going to spend it on more live-action shows. And anyone who thinks otherwise is fooling themselves. The more the lie is told, the more people think it's true. You know, like the lie that Cartoon Network's original name was supposed to be the Acme Network. It wasn't true. That's something spun by folks trying to push the live-action agenda on Cartoon Network.

You want to get more 9-14 year olds to watch Cartoon Network? You can do that by acquiring and developing CARTOONS that connects with that age group, not flush money into live-action ventures to satisfy a need to be like your competitors. Why are they picking up shows dominated by teen casts?

Half of the demographics they're trying to reach are already confused about why they're picking up live-action fare and the other half are watching Nick and Disney Channel and don't plan on leaving those channels anytime soon.

[PalmelaFC]

You want to get more 9-14 year olds to watch Cartoon Network? You can do that by acquiring and developing CARTOONS that connects with that age group, not flush money into live-action ventures to satisfy a need to be like your competitors. Why are they picking up shows dominated by teen casts.

I think it's because of the success of Total Drama Island. Perhaps the people running CN thought that reality shows are what kids and teens watch these days. So after TDI, CN thought of making and acquiring teen reality shows.

Don't you think this is true?

[Blackstar]

I think it's because of the success of Total Drama Island. Perhaps the people running CN thought that reality shows are what kids and teens watch these days. So after TDI, CN thought of making and acquiring teen reality shows.

Don't you think this is true?

I don't because Total Drama Island isn't a reality show; it's a parody of reality shows. There's no reason for me to believe that TDI sparked an interest in CN to produce reality shows of their own. Most likely, the decision was made because reality shows are hot right now. However, I don't believe that TDI was the sole cause for the CN Real movement. CN Real was going to happen, TDI or no TDI.

[Jeff Harris]

I think it's because of the success of Total Drama Island. Perhaps the people running CN thought that reality shows are what kids and teens watch these days. So after TDI, CN thought of making and acquiring teen reality shows.

Don't you think this is true?No. I don't think it's true. If kids were interested in reality shows, don't you think Nickelodeon and Disney Channel would be airing them en masse on their networks the way Cartoon Network is planning to do? I don't even hear about them developing reality shows let alone airing them. If kids wanted to watch reality shows, Discovery Kids would be the number one kids network, since the kind of shows Cartoon Network are planning on airing this week have been on DK for a decade now.

But right now, Spongebob Squarepants is the biggest kids show in the United States and constantly ranks in the Nielsen Top 10 Cable Shows week after week. Not just the Top 10 Children's Programming list. ALL of cable. Perhaps if they advertised the hell out of Chowder and Flapjack as they're doing for the CN Real shows, Cartoon Network could get at least a fraction of Spongebob's audience.

[TheVofSteel]

And who the heck is True Jackson, because he thinks she's cute too?


True Jackson is another Nickelodeon live-action show that airs on Saturday nights after iCarly.

[The Overlord]

No. I don't think it's true. If kids were interested in reality shows, don't you think Nickelodeon and Disney Channel would be airing them en masse on their networks the way Cartoon Network is planning to do? I don't even hear about them developing reality shows let alone airing them. If kids wanted to watch reality shows, Discovery Kids would be the number one kids network, since the kind of shows Cartoon Network are planning on airing this week have been on DK for a decade now.

But right now, Spongebob Squarepants is the biggest kids show in the United States and constantly ranks in the Nielsen Top 10 Cable Shows week after week. Not just the Top 10 Children's Programming list. ALL of cable. Perhaps if they advertised the hell out of Chowder and Flapjack as they're doing for the CN Real shows, Cartoon Network could get at least a fraction of Spongebob's audience.

Yeah TDI was a joke, this taking the stuff TDI makes fun of and playing it seriously. That's like a cosmic joke.

That's the big problem these shows are so lazy and cynical they have no effort behind them. CN is just assuming kids are dumb enough to watch anything they air that is live action.

Again I have wonder why doesn't CN just do what Canadian animators do, market research? Did they do any research before doing this or did they just assume kids would like it.

Hey kids like super heroes, why not make super hero cartoon with more of an edge to it, like a Hulk or daredvil cartoon or something.

[chdr]

Again I have wonder why doesn't CN just do what Canadian animators do, market research? Did they do any research before doing this or did they just assume kids would like it.They do market research. They're just not very good at it.

[solomon]

Well for one thing, you guys are forgetting that while CN has been GRAAAAAAAADUALLLY pushing it's BS and P envelope, this is still america.

Soccer Mom and parent groups are a pain in the neck to deal with and any and all animation has to be sanitized of any content that may reflect how children actually think and act in the REAL WORLD.

Total Drama is a start but I still don't see why they edit out the words "crap" and "suck" among other things and then go and advertize PG-13 fare like Transformers and Star Trek.

[The Overlord]

They do market research. They're just not very good at it.

At fresh Entertainment they just go the Eaton's center and ask tweens what they like, how hard would it be to do something like that?

Well for one thing, you guys are forgetting that while CN has been GRAAAAAAAADUALLLY pushing it's BS and P envelope, this is still america.

Soccer Mom and parent groups are a pain in the neck to deal with and any and all animation has to be sanitized of any content that may reflect how children actually think and act in the REAL WORLD.

Total Drama is a start but I still don't see why they edit out the words "crap" and "suck" among other things and then go and advertize PG-13 fare like Transformers and Star Trek.

These reality shows have mild swearing, vomiting and other such things, why is that ok?

[Kuromi_Star]

What CN calls mild swearing and what everyone thinks is mild swearing seems to be two different things but I honestly think that Nick is better with getting things that might not be totally appropriate according to the PTC on the air.

Oh and I don't think it's so much about being bad at doing market research as not knowing what to do with it.

[LeatherJeans]

My little cousin is a great barometer of things for that elusive tween demographic. He's 12. He thinks it's stupid that Cartoon Network is airing live-action ("Because they're Cartoon Network," he tells me). He's not a fan of those card/game based cartoons, but he likes cartoons like Chowder, Flapjack, Spongebob Squarepants, and 6Teen. Not to mention he's a wrestling fanatic. He doesn't like Hannah Montana nor much of anything on The Disney Channel but he likes iCarly because he thinks Miranda Cosgrove is cute . . . whoever she is. And who the heck is True Jackson, because he thinks she's cute too?

Like I said, he's a good barometer of what the tweens like because, um, he's a tween.

One of my cousins is a tween but she's barley 10. She enjoys watching everything on Nick, CN, and Disney. She actually watched The Powerpuff Girls since she was younger and had a Bubbles backpack. But when she hears about the live action ( I guess she probably heared it when watching TDI or Flapjack) She'll may watch it or just move on to what's her face Miley and The Jonas Brothers. I'm not really a big fan of the Disney Channel. The only thing that makes me happy on that channel is Phineas and Ferb and Sonny with a chance. JONAS looks entertaining but its hard to watch.( During the times they show it, I'm mostly on my computer or playing the Wii ) Nick I do watch all the shows and as for CN I watch only Har Har Tharsdays and some other shows like LOSE or Johnny Test. She's actually a GOOD tween but the reason she watchs TV is cause she doesn't have the internet.

[solomon]

At fresh Entertainment they just go the Eaton's center and ask tweens what they like, how hard would it be to do something like that?



These reality shows have mild swearing, vomiting and other such things, why is that ok?


Well lemme rephrase that. I personally don't think that the original version of total drama really is all that offensive to children 9-10 years and up. I am not giving people carte blanche to go all "south park" level in childrens TV, it's just that I still think that in some cases, parents are too sensitive to censoring television.

But that's also demographers and progammers fault for not rating anything between 2-11 and 18-49.

[solomon]

What CN calls mild swearing and what everyone thinks is mild swearing seems to be two different things but I honestly think that Nick is better with getting things that might not be totally appropriate according to the PTC on the air.
.

Example?

[Dudley]

Again I have wonder why doesn't CN just do what Canadian animators do, market research? Did they do any research before doing this or did they just assume kids would like it.

When CN visited my college they told me they did research and they found out that kids relate to live-action more than they do with an animated character.
We all just went with it.

[The Overlord]

When CN visited my college they told me they did research and they found out that kids relate to live-action more than they do with an animated character.
We all just went with it.

And they think they relate the idiots who appear on reality TV?

Heck I can relate more to characters on Wall-E than I could to the characters on Blade Trinity.

[Dr.Pepper]

And they think they relate the idiots who appear on reality TV?
I know really. I can understand a kid relating to Hannah Montana or someone from iCarly, but to some random fool on a reality series :confused:

[Antiyonder]

When CN visited my college they told me they did research and they found out that kids relate to live-action more than they do with an animated character.
We all just went with it.

Sure, but that doesn't mean that they will clamour for it to be on CN. Unless they prove that a majority of the demograph directly ask for live action on CN, their research is faulty.

[Doz Hewson]

My little cousin is a great barometer of things for that elusive tween demographic. He's 12. He thinks it's stupid that Cartoon Network is airing live-action ("Because they're Cartoon Network," he tells me). He's not a fan of those card/game based cartoons, but he likes cartoons like Chowder, Flapjack, Spongebob Squarepants, and 6Teen. Not to mention he's a wrestling fanatic. He doesn't like Hannah Montana nor much of anything on The Disney Channel but he likes iCarly because he thinks Miranda Cosgrove is cute . . . whoever she is. And who the heck is True Jackson, because he thinks she's cute too?

Like I said, he's a good barometer of what the tweens like because, um, he's a tween.

True Jackson is the actress/singer/songwriter Lauren Keyana "Keke" Palmer.

[The Overlord]

Sure, but that doesn't mean that they will clamour for it to be on CN. Unless they prove that a majority of the demograph directly ask for live action on CN, their research is faulty.

In Canada animation companies that make shows aimed at tweens just ask what they like and just makes cartoons based around those answers. You think CN could do that.

[J!!!]

My little cousin is a great barometer of things for that elusive tween demographic. He's 12. He thinks it's stupid that Cartoon Network is airing live-action ("Because they're Cartoon Network," he tells me). He's not a fan of those card/game based cartoons, but he likes cartoons like Chowder, Flapjack, Spongebob Squarepants, and 6Teen. Not to mention he's a wrestling fanatic. He doesn't like Hannah Montana nor much of anything on The Disney Channel but he likes iCarly because he thinks Miranda Cosgrove is cute . . . whoever she is. And who the heck is True Jackson, because he thinks she's cute too?

Like I said, he's a good barometer of what the tweens like because, um, he's a tween.
My cousin's a teen too and he thinks a different way then what yours does.

He likes CN showing LA because well he thinks ghost are cool. He is a big fan of the card game shows CN had because...he likes to see the monsters animated of the cards he buys. He likes all the shows on Disney Channel because he thinks there funny. And likes iCarly because..it's funny not just because Miranda Cosgove is cute.

And most of his friends think like that. So you can't use one tween as the example of how most tweens think.

[Kuromi_Star]

Example?
Nick has whole plots of episodes about things that are just wrong as opposed to CN allowing a mild sex joke here and there.

Example? The episode of Spongebob where they thought they killed the health inspector. If the parent groups weren't so busy making a big deal about two teens flirting or a fart joke they might realize that Sponge Bob and Mr Krabs not only assaulted the health inspector but they thought they killed him and proceeded to try and bury the body and hide it from the police.

[CCFridays]

My cousin's a teen too and he thinks a different way then what yours does.

He likes CN showing LA because well he thinks ghost are cool. He is a big fan of the card game shows CN had because...he likes to see the monsters animated of the cards he buys. He likes all the shows on Disney Channel because he thinks there funny. And likes iCarly because..it's funny not just because Miranda Cosgove is cute.

And most of his friends think like that. So you can't use one tween as the example of how most tweens think.

I'm 14...and I'm just going to say that barely any of the shows except for maybe 2 appeal to me. And that's the same with a couple of my friends (It got into a short discussion at lunch, and yeah...). My brother (12) doesn't like the shows either. The only reason he watched the premiere of the live action shows last night was because the man from Survivor Man was on it. So, if they're trying to target these shows to the 9-14 demographic, its definately not calling my/our names to watch it. I mean, seeing teenagers on some live action show isn't going to make me wanna watch it.

and somewhere in here there was a post about them making cartoons connecting more with our age group. I think the same thing. I can connect way more with Chowder and Flapjack then I can with the live action shows.

[Jeff Harris]

My cousin's a teen too and he thinks a different way then what yours does.I know. People are different. But channels are becoming similar throughout the channelscape, and uniqueness is being thrown out the door. Kids aren't going to be the same.

He likes CN showing LA because well he thinks ghost are cool. Then perhaps you should introduce him to Bleach, Death Note, and Scooby-Doo. They can be found on the network as well. Oh, and get him a couple of DVDs of Yu Yu Hakusho and The Real Ghostbusters. They're realer than anything Cartoon Network has to offer when it comes to ghosts.

He is a big fan of the card game shows CN had because...he likes to see the monsters animated of the cards he buys.So, he likes animated versions of the card monsters? That's understandable. But doesn't he know those 4Kids-produced shows come on Disney XD (at least Chaotic), weekends on The CW, and daily online at 4kids.tv? I'm not a fan, but I knew that.

He likes all the shows on Disney Channel because he thinks there funny.Taste differs from person to person. Otherwise, every show would be on every network. I think some Disney Channel movies are funny. Hatching Pete was pretty good.

And you mean "they're," right?

And likes iCarly because..it's funny not just because Miranda Cosgrove is cute.But it helps. And I think it'd be foolish not to consider attractiveness as a factor in those shows' success. Hollywood is a very superficial place which is why people that look like you, me, or your friends aren't on television on a weekly basis. They'll never put average-looking folks on scripted television, and when average-looking folks are on television, they're there mostly for mocking. That's why that whole Susan Boyle thing across the pond was so big in the media.

"An average-looking person singing like an angel rather than screeching out of tune? Facinating!"

Moronic.

And most of his friends think like that. So you can't use one tween as the example of how most tweens think.And neither can you. Like I said moments ago, kids are different.

[partysmores999]

First up, kids want PG. We didn't want any old guy telling us what to do and telling us what rating to air our shows as.
"Oh no! They said "Crap" on Total Drama Island! I must tell the FCC and stop my kids from watching this HORRIBLE show that is just like South Park!"
I got 2 words for those soccer-moms.
Who
CARES!
And TDI is NOTHING like South Park.

[MegaSonic55]

If parents really wanted to get a show off the air, they would complain, but you could literally take each and every show and find something wrong with it. That's why there is a thing that tells you what age is suitable for watching these shows, and parents don't seem to pay attention to that. Thus ruining it for other people who like the show. I mean you could say chowder show obscene eating habits, you could say the eds promote being greedy, and etc, and on and on, you could make whatever arguments you want, and that's why saturday night cartoons aren't really good anymore, because it has to fulfill educational content, what happened to just watching cartoons because they were funny? It's all about being politically correct, and it's a pain in the butt.

[Lord Palf]

Nick has whole plots of episodes about things that are just wrong as opposed to CN allowing a mild sex joke here and there.

Example? The episode of Spongebob where they thought they killed the health inspector. If the parent groups weren't so busy making a big deal about two teens flirting or a fart joke they might realize that Sponge Bob and Mr Krabs not only assaulted the health inspector but they thought they killed him and proceeded to try and bury the body and hide it from the police.

Yea, and in like, two episodes of ICarly, they almost mention the private.

[Rolling Cloud]

So, he likes animated versions of the card monsters? That's understandable. But doesn't he know those 4Kids-produced shows come on Disney XD (at least Chaotic), weekends on The CW, and daily online at 4kids.tv? I'm not a fan, but I knew that.

Um, I know Chaotic falls under 4kids produced but, you can't really throw 5D's under the same label. It's only dubbed by them.