So much for freedom of speech

[cyde]

America may be a free place but it seems no matter where you're at, it seems no one's got a right to speak out their own viewpoints.

[Ickis]

America may be a free place but it seems no matter where you're at, it seems no one's got a right to speak out their own viewpoints. "Freedom of Speech" accounts merely for people to be allowed by law to say what they want, not for each individual to act maturely when hearing an opposing opinion. Don't be afraid to speak your own opinions though, one should be tough in life. Don't be overly defensive either as many people bicker merely to protect their own opinion(s).

[Blackstar]

Well, I don't know what brought this on, but...

The main purpose of internet message boards is the exchange of different opinions. Someone isn't necessarily violating the First Amendment if they have an opinion that stands in direct contrast from your own.

[cyde]

Seems like some people want the constitution rewritten, especially for freedom not to speak.:sweat:

[Silverstar]

I know nothing of the current situation or the cause of this thread's creation, but...

Sometimes it's not what a person says which torques some folks off, but how/when/where one says it. There's nothing wrong with expressing your viewpoints, but if said viewpoints are off-topic, illogical, offensive or hurtful to a particular person or group, or worded in a rude or irresponsible manner, then one is bound to catch some flack about it.

I try to be as courteous as possible (honestly, I do) when addressing a topic or an opinion, even the ones which I flatly disagree with. It's not always the easiest thing to do, but you do catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.

[cyde]

I know nothing of the current situation or the cause of this thread's creation, but...

Sometimes it's not what a person says which torques some folks off, but how/when/where one says it. There's nothing wrong with expressing your viewpoints, but if said viewpoints are off-topic, illogical, offensive or hurtful to a particular person or group, or worded in a rude or irresponsible manner, then one is bound to catch some flack about it.

I try to be as courteous as possible (honestly, I do) when addressing a topic or an opinion, even the ones which I flatly disagree with. It's not always the easiest thing to do, but you do catch more flies with honey than with vinegar."Not if you're diabetic." --Daria Morgendorffer.

[Antiyonder]

Sometimes it's not what a person says which torques some folks off, but how/when/where one says it. There's nothing wrong with expressing your viewpoints, but if said viewpoints are off-topic, illogical, offensive or hurtful to a particular person or group, or worded in a rude or irresponsible manner, then one is bound to catch some flack about it.

Agreed.

There's a difference between saying "I don't care for action cartoons" and saying "Action cartoons are stupid and anyone who says otherwise is a teh retarded sux".

Freedom of speech doesn't equate with Freedom of incivility.

[Draft]

America may be a free place but it seems no matter where you're at, it seems no one's got a right to speak out their own viewpoints.

meh, anything anybody believes in has people who disagree with the belief.., so this shouldn't come as a suprise to you or anyone else

*waits for the lock hammer to destroy this topic*

[Yusuke Urameshi]

What was the point of this thread?

Unless it was to prove a point, which, I don't see happening.

[Ajax]

So basically, OP gives us a sentence and a quote from Daria......i dont get it?

[Antiyonder]

What was the point of this thread?

That people have a right to express incivility.

I suppose Wolf believes that a person has a right to call out "fire" in a public theater.

[cyde]

That people have a right to express incivility.

I suppose Wolf believes that a person has a right to call out "fire" in a public theater.Not if there was a real fire in the theater. But all the same, it's so confusing.

[Antiyonder]

Not if there was a real fire in the theater. But all the same, it's so confusing.

It's pretty simple. Freedom of speech means to say what's on your mind, as long as you express it in a civil mature manner.

[Blackstar]

It's pretty simple. Freedom of speech means to say what's on your mind, as long as you express it in a civil mature manner.

Precisely. It's OK to have an opinion, even an unpopular one, but one shouldn't fly off the handle solely if someone feels the exact opposite of how you feel and says so. It's only if someone responds with hostility or a personal attack that you should take to the defensive. However, it's best to not stoop to the offending poster's level by getting into a match of insults and put downs.

Similarly, one should try not to express their own personal opinion as being the one and only truth.

[Wounded_Dragon]

But Freedom of Speech doesn't give you the right to say whatever you want wherever you want. People on the Internet often lose sight of this.

Freedom of speech doesn't give me the right to barge into your house and say whatever I want. If I do walk into a person's home and they wish me to leave because of certain speeches, there's no freedom of speech to shield me. I have to leave or get arrested.

People on the Internet are so used to going everywhere and getting stuff for free that they think everything is free and that there are no boundaries.

[KPTitan]

America may be a free place but it seems no matter where you're at, it seems no one's got a right to speak out their own viewpoints.

I really like your avatar....just had to say that.:cool:

I know what you mean, especially on the Internet. When you speak your own opinion about stuff (anime and cartoons for instance) you always got one or a whole lot of 'em flamming you down the drain. In elementary school, it was pretty bad, because alot of little kids think that whatever THEY know, it's the RIGHT way or opinion, and they get into HUGE arguments about it all day long, and hardly never let it go. Been there, done that...experiencing it, I mean.

[GregX]

Freedom of speech does not mean freedom from opposing view points. Far from it.

Freedom of speech pretty much means that you can stand outside the White House holding a sign trashing the president without worry over getting arrested.

Freedom of speech does not mean you can say and do whatever on private property.

You can't just go into someone's house and say whatever you want and not expect to get thrown out.

You can't go to work, say what ever you want and not get fired.

You can't say what ever you want on a messageboard like this and expect not to get warned or banned.

Private property.

But, more than that. Freedom of speech does not mean you can say what ever you want and not expect people to disagree and tell you they think you're wrong. Far from it, and that seems to be the most popular misconception with the whole thing. Every time I hear someone complain about freedom of speech, it always comes back to people disagreeing with them about something.

[Kitschensyngk]

Whenever you post an opinion on the Internet, 95% of the people who read it will disagree with you, and will emphasize it in the loudest, crudest and most immature language possible.

They think it's to correct the 5% who agree, but I think it's actually meant to drown out the 95% who disagree with them.

[Temple Fugate]

Not if there was a real fire in the theater. But all the same, it's so confusing.The tricky thing with freedom is that everybody has it, not just one person. It's impossible to have absolute freedom without encroaching on the freedom of another. I can tell someone they're ugly. That's freedom of speech. But that kind of disrespectful exercising of my freedom has a negative impact on the other person.

When we speak our minds, we often forget that there is always the chance that we're either wrong about our facts, or are in the minority with our opinions. We're very selfish thinkers and expect the world to not only accept our points of view, but to agree with us as well.

Everyone needs to learn that we each have unique perspectives and that sometimes we will enjoy or desire different things. I hate onions. Others love onions. It would be disrespectful and unreasonable of me to demand that everyone eating at the same restaurant as I am should not eat onions in front of me. They are as free to eat those onions as I am free to not want to eat onions. They have come to that restaurant to eat onions, not to listen to me tell them how much I hate onions.

This post is getting a little strange so I'll wrap it up. The bottom line: Respect others, and think before you speak. Be open to the possibility of alternate viewpoints and even re-evaluating your opinion. There is a difference between talking TO someone and talking WITH someone.

[Dr.Pepper]

You can say whatever you want, as long as you don't say it rudly.

[Ajax]

You can say whatever you want, as long as you don't say it rudly.Yeah, I highly doubt that going up to a bunch of black dudes and nicely saying hey [insert racial slur] is gonna keep me from dragging my remains to the hospital.:D

[purplehairedwonder]

You can say whatever you want, as long as you don't say it rudly.Not true, actually. While the First Amendment does grant us Freedom of Speech, there are certain things that are not protected by the Constitution like hate speech, false advertising, yelling "Fire" in a crowded movie theater, conspiring to overthrow the government with clear and present danger and so on.

[Dr.Pepper]

Not true, actually. While the First Amendment does grant us Freedom of Speech, there are certain things that are not protected by the Constitution like hate speech, false advertising, yelling "Fire" in a crowded movie theater, conspiring to overthrow the government with clear and present danger and so on.
Oh yeah. I forgot about that. I was just thinking about how the first admendment doesn't protect profanity.

[peacebyanymeans]

Oh yeah. I forgot about that. I was just thinking about how the first admendment doesn't protect profanity.

The first amendment does protect profanity.

[Hanshotfirst113]

Freedom of speech does not mean freedom from opposing view points. Far from it.

Freedom of speech pretty much means that you can stand outside the White House holding a sign trashing the president without worry over getting arrested.

Freedom of speech does not mean you can say and do whatever on private property.

You can't just go into someone's house and say whatever you want and not expect to get thrown out.

You can't go to work, say what ever you want and not get fired.

You can't say what ever you want on a messageboard like this and expect not to get warned or banned.

Private property.

But, more than that. Freedom of speech does not mean you can say what ever you want and not expect people to disagree and tell you they think you're wrong. Far from it, and that seems to be the most popular misconception with the whole thing. Every time I hear someone complain about freedom of speech, it always comes back to people disagreeing with them about something.

There is a difference between "freedom of speech" and "freedom from the consequences of said speech."

[cyde]

The irony is, even when you post even the most nonoffenseive thing, even a thing of interest here in forums like TZ, people jump on you and call you a troll, and worse still, say in effect, "No one cares what you got to say." It's happened to me and my battle buddies.

[Antiyonder]

The irony is, even when you post even the most nonoffenseive thing, even a thing of interest here in forums like TZ, people jump on you and call you a troll, and worse still, say in effect, "No one cares what you got to say." It's happened to me and my battle buddies.

Perhaps if you could give an example of what was posted and the exact response?

[GregX]

The irony is, even when you post even the most nonoffenseive thing, even a thing of interest here in forums like TZ, people jump on you and call you a troll, and worse still, say in effect, "No one cares what you got to say." It's happened to me and my battle buddies.

And how is that a violation of freedom of speech? Because I think it has become obvious to everyone here that you don't know what freedom of speech actually is.

[.bg]

Perhaps if you could give an example of what was posted and the exact response?
Here, I'll do it for him. (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=220372&page=4)

[Master-Dee]

Well I think freedom of speech is a previlege for everybody and it has to e earned. But it is the law. But in some cases in some states it could be regulated. So in the First Amendment it just says freedom of speech, now there's alot of loopholes there. We should be asking ourselves what kind of speech? See there you go. There's alot of speech and some can be regulated.

As a future lawer/prosecuter(Assistant D.A.) there's alot of standing on freedom of speech.

[cathedral]

freedom of speech does not exist. not anywhere else and certainly not here at TZ. if you want to know what i'm talking about just try to have some intelligent discussion about almost anything. politics, religion... the only type of things we're free to talk about here are what we got for christmas or what kind of breakfast cereal we like. out in the world you are actually allowed to state your opinion but saying anything about killing the president gets you red flagged and i think arrested and who knows what else. but now that Barack Obama will be in office the death threats will surely decline. :D (that was a joke)

:sweat: uh oh, was that too political?

[SaMaster14]

Well you can't talk about killing someone because it could either "incite" you to do it, or incite others to act. there is freedom of speech, but with quite a few restrictions. Like you can't yell "fire" in a movie theater if there is no fire because it starts mass chaos and is dangerous. plus, lying under oath is illegal, etc etc.

[AlgeaX]

And how is that a violation of freedom of speech? Because I think it has become obvious to everyone here that you don't know what freedom of speech actually is.

Amen, A lot of people seem to think that freedom of speech means freedom from criticism.

Paul: The Holocaust never happened!

Peter: What are you talking about? they have mountains of historical evidence, heck my dad was at Auswitch!

Paul: How dare you violate my freedom of speech? What are you, some kind of Nazi?


You can express any kind of opinion you want, but once you put it out there everybody else is just as free to pick it apart. Obama may not be able to throw you in jail for calling him a jerk, but there's nothing stopping him from going on TV and giving a half hour speech about what an idiot you are.

[SaMaster14]

Amen, A lot of people seem to think that freedom of speech means freedom from criticism.

Paul: The Holocaust never happened!

Peter: What are you talking about? they have mountains of historical evidence, heck my dad was at Auswitch!

Paul: How dare you violate my freedom of speech? What are you, some kind of Nazi?


You can express any kind of opinion you want, but once you put it out there everybody else is just as free to pick it apart. Obama may not be able to throw you in jail for calling him a jerk, but there's nothing stopping him from going on TV and giving a half hour speech about what an idiot you are.

I agree, but only to a certain point.

As I said, there are things that are illegal to say. If you yell fire in a movie theather when there is no fire, you will be arrested. you can be put in jail for threatening someone as well, or lying under oath... pergury, incitement, etc etc.

though, I do agree to the main statement that you are free to say what you want, but others may criticize you and have their own opinions.

[BrendaBat]

Originally posted by Wolf359
The irony is, even when you post even the most nonoffenseive thing, even a thing of interest here in forums like TZ, people jump on you and call you a troll, and worse still, say in effect, "No one cares what you got to say." It's happened to me and my battle buddies.

Uh, Welcome to the Internet, dude. EVERYONE who's ever posted on a messageboard has had their opinions torn apart by some jackass. It's not just you.
Yeah, you have freedom of speech and all. But so do the rest of us Americans. I swear, I've read the first amendment and it doesn't specifically mention you. :p


And, FYI, if you don't want to be called a troll, don't wish for the deaths of innocent voice actors and then cry about your first amendment rights being violated when people tell you that you need to see a psychiatrist.

[purplehairedwonder]

Considering this thread has gotten personal, I'm going to go ahead and lock it.