Is it just me, or are a lot of ASA's leads unlikeable?

[Beat]

Something I was thinking about. Death Note stars a psychopath kid with a god complex and his main rivals are cutthroat detectives. The entire cast of Code Geass are arguably, jerks. And both are doing poorly right now. Do you think the casts of either show are unlikeable? And if yes, is that turning people away?

[Angilasman]

Eureka Seven was filled to the brim with likeable characters and it did poorly in the ratings.

[Beat]

Eureka Seven was filled to the brim with likeable characters and it did poorly in the ratings.

I wouldn't call them likeable if the plot turns people away, but this is another topic.

[bigdeath]

It seems anime is a really niche market on US TV so it appears to rarely get high ratings. Eureka Seven, Death Note, and Code Geass are all popular shows so its not valid to say their plot is poor or characters are not likeably.

The low ratings might have to do with the fact that most anime fans will have already seen an anime by the time it comes to the US. Anime companies really need to speed up sending anime across the ocean but they can't afford that. Some are considering putting up their animes dubed online while the show airs but that doesn't solve the problem that anime fans will have seen the show by the time it airs on TV in the US.

[xokxtrunks]

Lelouch from Code Geass isn't unlikeable :shrug:

[Master Moron]

Eureka Seven was filled to the brim with likeable characters and it did poorly in the ratings.

What? How were the Eureka 7 characters likeable? You had the bratty kids, the jerkwad captain, his hooker girlfriend, so many horrible characters.

[tb4000]

Anime that's supposedly more "deeper" than just Saturday morning fare that they produce over there is usually filled with angsty, morally ambiguous casts of characters. That's just how they are.

[chelydra]

Do you think the casts of either show are unlikeable?
That's an interesting take there. Personally I did find Light slightly unlikable, but not enough to stop watching DN. But, after thinking a bit, the characters in DN and CG do seem somewhat self-centered. That might be enough to make them uninteresting to some.

And if yes, is that turning people away?
I can't really say, since I've watched only a little over a dozen anime series in my life. Maybe they're not attracting a large following since many people are conditioned to think cartoons=funny and nothing else.

[Captain Highwind]

Because we all know Peter Griffin is a charming aristocrat.

And Family Guy is excelling most of the time in ratings.

Wait...

[Angilasman]

What? How were the Eureka 7 characters likeable? You had the bratty kids, the jerkwad captain, his hooker girlfriend, so many horrible characters.

...well, I liked them, so I'd define them as likeable.

[Neo Ultra Mike]

Originally posted by Mr. Highwind
Because we all know Peter Griffin is a charming aristocrat.

And Family Guy is excelling most of the time in ratings.

Wait...

I think this point was made before on this board in a pretty old thread talking about Wolf's Rain, but there's a difference between comedic characters and dramatic characters. Comedic characters can be more annoying and irritating and troublesome and never change at all because the value of the show comes from seeing them bungle and be funny and do stupid things to make us laugh. That's why Peter can get away from being retarded and still being enjoyable and Master Shake can get away with being a total a**hole as long as they're really funny. It's only when the material with them becomes unfunny do the shows themselves really loose they're appeal. Which is much different then an anime where the point of the characters is not to entertain you, but to feel for they're plight and situations and where they're character arc is going.

So really I'm pretty sure its' the fact that there are a lot more people in america looking for more of a cheap laugh in animation then a good plot or developing character that is the reason why anime dosen't do as well as regular cartoons. Espically Adult Swim shows since face it, most adults aren't going to be looking for a cartoon for characters they can symphatize with and feel bad for and want to see improve. They're looking for people they can laugh at and enjoy they're bungeling since they're not looking for emotional attachment in something animated for the most part. If the show is life action yeah but there's still a huge animated/live action gap when it comes to what you can do in each medium that still affects american programming. Which is one of the biggest reasons why a Family Guy repeat can easily out ratings a preimere of Code Geass or Death Note when it had premieres.

People also have different variant taste on what makes an appealing character. For example for me I find characters who are interesting and unique more appearling then just the same cliche hero type. Which is actually why I prefer the characters of Code Geass and Death Note to those found in say Inuyasha or Bleach: They break more of a mold and do more relable or generally more interesting things. Sometimes that may make them unlikable sure but I find it much more interesting to see Light come up with a clever plan to manipulate people or Lelouche sacrifice the Japan Liberation to get to Corneilia then seeing Ichigo make some speech about not wanting to fight his opponent and then swinging his sword down a few times. But that's just me I guess.

[zoombie]

I wish Leloush would take off the mask, and not hide behind it like a coward, and face the consiquence for what he chooses to. He so untrusting of people, he erased Shirley's memories, he tried to brain wash C2 at the end of the last episode, all because he has to keep his identity secret.

The lead in the only comedy ASA show Shin, the Shin you see on adult swim is a little bit of a jerk. The original or real Shin Chan is a very likeable loveable character. Maybe you have a point, that even the nice characters they to turn into jerks.

[Jayngfet]

Let me use a role playing game example to make a point on likeability versus popularity: Drow elves. Unless they're angsty ripoffs or naive idiots they're arrogant, selfish murderers who'll murder you out of boredom and were actually designed to be wholly unlikeable.

And yet the fanboys go wild over them to the point where everybody is sick of them.

Moral of the story:Pople like selfish jerks so long as they're good looking.

[Kiryu]

I thought most of the cast of Eureka 7 was rather likeable as well. Besides Dewey, Holland and Anemone most of the characters are pretty much completely good, nice, happy, innocent, etc.

But anyway I don't think having an unlikable protagonist brings down the ratings, people *love* to hate on things. People love to watch bastards get whats coming to them in the end. Thats part of what makes sports and reality shows so popular. Almost everyone wants to see characters they hate go down in flames. So I doubt thats the real problem with Death Note and Code Geass, most likely its just the time slot/lack of advertising/lack of people with enough brain cells to realize how enjoyable anime is.

[Angilasman]

^Well said my also-has-a-Godzilla-series-monster-username friend.

[Dai_Maxwell]

Something I was thinking about. Death Note stars a psychopath kid with a god complex and his main rivals are cutthroat detectives. The entire cast of Code Geass are arguably, jerks. And both are doing poorly right now. Do you think the casts of either show are unlikeable? And if yes, is that turning people away?

I liked Light and was disappointed he didn't come out on top. The problem is, he just didn't take it far enough for me. Now if I had the book...

A friend of mine watched the first ep and I think was freaked out too much by Ryuk. Just like she was freaked out by the Hollows in Bleach. But I nagged and nagged her to get past the initial horror of some of the sub-characters and she really got into them. Too bad Death Note is off without a complete replay.

.

[Anubis C. Soundwave]

I liked Light and was disappointed he didn't come out on top. The problem is, he just didn't take it far enough for me. Now if I had the book...

A friend of mine watched the first ep and I think was freaked out too much by Ryuk. Just like she was freaked out by the Hollows in Bleach. But I nagged and nagged her to get past the initial horror of some of the sub-characters and she really got into them. Too bad Death Note is off without a complete replay.

.

Seriously, Light went pretty far with it. Killed criminals, killed almost anyone who got in his way.... :eek::o

[zoombie]

I think almost the entire cast of Code Geass are hypocritical about something. It does resmbles real life more, in the middle east, no one side is completely good, they are evil in their own way. Same thing with the two waring sides of Code Geass.

The Black Knights would kill unarmed Britanna civilians without hesitance. I am all for the liberation of Japan, but sometimes they go too far.

To the people of Japan, the Black Knights are Freedom Fighter, to the people of Britanna they are Terroiest, and both sides are correct. And using an american prospective, they are comparable to both our founding fathers who freed the colonies from English rule, and Al Quada.

[Dai_Maxwell]

Seriously, Light went pretty far with it. Killed criminals, killed almost anyone who got in his way.... :eek::o

He went after too many petty criminals it seemed. He should have gone after world leaders, CEO's, Bill Gates - even though he's not a CEO anymore - and the loud obnoxious pitchman <coughBillyMayHayescough>. Also, he should have gone after far more politicians. Hell, he could have even taken out "unfriendly" countries . Oh, and why so many with heart attacks? Where was his creativity? There are some really embarassing ways to die, you know... :evil:

[Jayngfet]

Which would have put more people on him, he may be a genius be he isn't invincible.

[Master Moron]

The Black Knights would kill unarmed Britanna civilians without hesitance. I am all for the liberation of Japan, but sometimes they go too far.


What? When have the Black Knights killed unarmed Britannia civilians?

[Dai_Maxwell]

He went after too many people in an enclosed environment. At the same time, imagine writing down and killing 10 presidents/prime ministers/dictators names all on the same day. Statistically, that would be a giant red flag. Of couse, if he would have acted rationally, ie., cautiously, Death Note would be on ep 70+ now and be an entirely different series.

[zoombie]

What? When have the Black Knights killed unarmed Britannia civilians?

Well Zero has said many times, he would do anything to achieve his goals. And he would use anybdoy and kill anybody to win.

If you are not satisfied by that, I am sorry that is all I can say. PM me.

[FinnMacCool]

What? When have the Black Knights killed unarmed Britannia civilians?
During the Narita battle, when Lelouch caused the landslide the destruction spread to a nearby populated area, killing at least one civilian (Shirley's father) and quite probably more given all the corpses the military was cleaning up. Granted, the collateral damage wasn't intentional, but Lelouch admitted he hadn't taken all the precautions he could have in setting the bomb up.