SHUT UP ABOUT NON-EDITS! [read]

[The Landstander]

C.) Possible edits in upcoming series/anime - DO NOT DISCUSS!!

For a while now, many of us have wondered "Do the CN censors check the internet to see what questionable content occurs in their shows?" (if you go over to TTTP you'll get many answers about those situations.) Well, after what happened in one Inuyasha episode ("Kikyo's Stolen Ashes"), and the editing that occurred in "My Birthday Pursuit" that I'm sure everyone here is aware of, but the similar circumstances that weren't edited in a later episode, we're pretty convinced now that that's EXACTLY what's happening here.

So with that, talking about what might be edited in an upcoming series or episode is STRICTLY FORBIDDEN. We don't want to see users pointing out scenes that might be edited, due to the risk that someone from CN might see it and tell WS or the distributor to remove it, thus ruining our fun.It's right there in the FAQ, people.

It's been shown to be true on a few occasions, at this board and elsewhere on TZ (such as on the TTTP back in the day), that editing people like to come here and find out what they missed. Evil and mean people who hate you come here and read about missed edits, and then go and re-edit.

So, just for clarity:
1) If you think Captain Arroyo's nipple is probably going to get edited in the next episode, DON'T TALK ABOUT IT.
2) If the S&P missed the edit on Captain Arroyo's nipple, DON'T TALK ABOUT IT.
3) If on a rerun airing Captain Arroyo's nipple has magically returned, DON'T TALK ABOUT IT.
4) If you can think of another scenario where this applies (nipples or not), DON'T TALK ABOUT IT then, either.
On a side note, the S&P can highlight spoiler boxes, too. They have mouses. And keyboards.

This is a really really simple rule that prevents bad things from happening. So please, don't point this stuff out and do the editing for them.

Thank you.


(if the wording on this seems a bit off, it's because it's 3 AM =( )

[Ben]

On a side note, the S&P can highlight spoiler boxes, too. They have mouses. And keyboards.

I had no idea. Dastardly!

[Chris Wood]

They forgot to edit the nipples in that first post.

[G1Ravage]

Does this mean anime will never air at TV-MA unless it's kept a secret from the world until the very minute it airs?

[The Landstander]

Does this mean anime will never air at TV-MA unless it's kept a secret from the world until the very minute it airs?For the purposes of this thread, yes.

[Artimus Gigan]

Remember, Eva would have aired the two episodes uncut on Toonami during Giant Robot week,IF NO ONE TALKED ABOUT THE EDITS, BUT THEY DID AND THUS MISATO HAD TO WEAR A FULL PIECE BATHING SUIT IN THE TUB!

So remember the first rule of the military when it comes to edits, don't ask and don't tell.

[Mr. Pedro]

It's things like this that cause my heart to die. Just a little bit more.

[Conan-san]

And thus the gated comunitey became even more so.

[Sketch]

Sigh... as if this will make people actually remember not to do that.

[Mr. Pedro]

Sigh... as if this will make people actually remember not to do that.Then this forum should be shut down completely the moment a "questionable" episode is announced and should not be re-opened until the morning after the ep has aired.

At least that way, no one can say that we screwed things up.

[Chrono1995]

Alls I gots to say is, holy crap; they spotted us quick. So, uh, don't do it again, all right? If we want to keep TV-MA around for anime, don't spell out what needs to go in the episode for them.

[LordByronius]

Dudes, wtf. You let me down. You let me down cold, man.

How could you.

I left for work today, thinkin', "oboy, TV-MA Champloo tomorrow; that'll be neat!" and now that dream is dead.

[Karl Olson]

The only good thing that may might come out of this is I'll finally be able to tell Kyle Pope definitively that he's need to stop the "Not-an-edit" crap. It's my one beef with the guy, and I've finally, clearly, undoubtly got the proof that S&P watches us like hawks.

...but man, this comes at all too much of a cost.

I really hope those who gabbed about specific edits learned their lesson. If you didn't, get ready for very swift modly action the next time you start to talk about why a show that CN already has can have this or that.

[Happy]

So it won't be TV-MA? I knew it wouldn't happen with you all screaming about it like a bunch of Yahoos.

[Chrono1995]

Unless, of course, they managed to stretch the TV-14 to its breaking point and are saving the MA for episodes that really, truly deserve it. But in all likelihood, I'm probably just dreaming...

[Conan-san]

I know this might sound a bit dumb, but somthing just poped into my mind, if we're doing edit lists anyway, ain't the SnP just going to figgure out that somthing looks out of place editing wise anyway?

Not trying to stir up anything, I know it's a bit dumb to casue this sorta controversy at this point but It just poped into my head.

[Eddie G.]

I know this might sound a bit dumb, but somthing just poped into my mind, if we're doing edit lists anyway, ain't the SnP just going to figgure out that somthing looks out of place editing wise anyway? I doubt that, if they didn't notice it before then why notice it not being on a list of things they did notice and edit? Of course in theory it could be argued that it's possible that the censors could've noticed something and then neglected to edit it. In that case then yeah, the edit list could in theory be used against us. So maybe we should get rid of edit lists too partly because of this unlikely situation and partly because I really hate edit lists.

[jethrek]

It's right there in the FAQ, people.

It's been shown to be true on a few occasions, at this board and elsewhere on TZ (such as on the TTTP back in the day), that editing people like to come here and find out what they missed. Evil and mean people who hate you come here and read about missed edits, and then go and re-edit.

So, just for clarity:
1) If you think Captain Arroyo's nipple is probably going to get edited in the next episode, DON'T TALK ABOUT IT.
2) If the S&P missed the edit on Captain Arroyo's nipple, DON'T TALK ABOUT IT.
3) If on a rerun airing Captain Arroyo's nipple has magically returned, DON'T TALK ABOUT IT.
4) If you can think of another scenario where this applies (nipples or not), DON'T TALK ABOUT IT then, either.
On a side note, the S&P can highlight spoiler boxes, too. They have mouses. And keyboards.

This is a really really simple rule that prevents bad things from happening. So please, don't point this stuff out and do the editing for them.

Thank you.


(if the wording on this seems a bit off, it's because it's 3 AM =( )
This situation is quite....stupid. I assume then we can report non-edit posts to moderators? :evil:

[Conan-san]

This situation is quite....stupid. I assume then we can report non-edit posts to moderators? :evil: Well, [non-edit posts]'s against the rules so I don't see why not, unless someone else would like to correct me?

[James Bester]

This is great. And I thought people would learn after what happened with the last minute "bull****" edit on Paranoia Agent.

[Superperson]

So we shouldn't post non-edits anymore or something?

[Timmay]

What proof do you have that it's this particular forum or if they even look at any forums in general.. I'm kinda confused on that.

[Conan-san]

This is great. And I thought people would learn after what happened with the last minute "bull****" edit on Paranoia Agent. TO be fair, that one was also called on Gaming Force too so they might of gotten that one there too.

As far as editing, I believe the porn girl's shirt was lowered to cover her nipples and that's all. The jump cut as it was loading was in the DVD version as well. "********" made the episode uncut, which I think is pretty cool.

[Tienshin]

So we shouldn't post non-edits anymore or something?

Yes, that would be the point of all of this.

[Superperson]

Yes, that would be the point of all of this.

Just wondering if we were all on the same wavelength.

[Jave]

What proof do you have that it's this particular forum or if they even look at any forums in general.. I'm kinda confused on that.A lot. Including people that work at certain companies have registered at this boards.

This is what you need to avoid mentioning:

"Well, [that series] is supposed to air soon, I hope they leave [that scene] where [that character] does [that thing]."

or

"Wow! [that series] just aired and I can't believe they left [that scene] in! (It has happened that people get episodes edited in subsequent reruns because of posting stuff like this.)

[Ben]

What proof do you have that it's this particular forum or if they even look at any forums in general.. I'm kinda confused on that.

Yeah, good point, how do we know they read these boards? It's not like they give us daily feedback in the form of some sort of on-air cards...

OH WAIT.

[Tienshin]

What proof do you have that it's this particular forum or if they even look at any forums in general.. I'm kinda confused on that.

As circumstancial as the evidence may be, we've observed situations where various non edits later became edits on Adult Swim, Toonami, and even some classics toon shows. Obviously we don't have tape recorded conversations or DNA supporting our claims, but in instances like these it's best to exercise a degree of restraint. CN has professionals to work editting issues, we don't need to help them do their job.

[Sketch]

It should be fairly obvious that CN knows about this site. Shoot man... WS checks the Arsenal to make sure people do their assigned work. So any forum here could be being monotored and most likely many of them are.

[livingfruitvirus]

I'm going to have to step in and defend this thread (http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=142963) in this case. The fact that it had a TV-MA on the AdultSwim.com and CartoonNetwork.com schedules made it look official and intentional that AS was going to air it this way, making it safe for discussion. Not to mention we've had MA rated episodes of Robot Chicken and Tom Goes to the Mayor by now. So one could assume easily that Adult Swim is allowed to air MA rated shows now. It's not like how people stupidly pointed out that someone said bullsh** in the first Paranoia Agent episode and it ended up being edited in the reruns, because that word is always (now anyway) edited out in TV-14 shows, so one could assume there was a 9/10 chance it was a mistake and clam up about it. I mean, no one posted about it when "f**k" was missed in a certain other recent broadcast (some of you know what I'm talking about, and no it's not ATHF).

[RD!]

Yeah, good point, how do we know they read these boards? It's not like they give us daily feedback in the form of some sort of on-air cards...
You're right... we're not the official Adultswim forums, whose existance makes this thread and issue a moot and unavoidable point.

[Nin-Nin69]

Thanks for trying to ruin a good thing here fellow members. :rolleyes:

[Superperson]

Is mentioning the non-edit multiple times in the first post of this topic helping any.

[guinaevere]

So one could assume easily that Adult Swim is allowed to air MA rated shows now. Allowed to air an MA rated program? Sure. But content matter is still subject to FCCs guidelines, and I'm sure CN isn't wanting to have to pay any hefty fees or chance losing their license.

[livingfruitvirus]

Sure. But content matter is still subject to FCCs guidelinesno it isn't

[Tienshin]

Allowed to air an MA rated program? Sure. But content matter is still subject to FCCs guidelines, and I'm sure CN isn't wanting to have to pay any hefty fees or chance losing their license.

No so much, the FCC's mandate is only applicable to free broadcast airwaves, not cable or satellite providers. At this point anyway.

[William C. Maune]

In response to lfv:

I don't think the problem was so much that people were talking about the episode going to be TV-MA. Instead, the bigger problem was folks pointing out reasons why it might have earned the TV-MA rating.

-----

Additionally, I'd just like to throw my support behind the thread in general. Some folks probably consider me a pain due to my enforcement of the rule in the past (hello Gundam SEED fans!). However, there are good reasons behind the rule and it really should be a fairly simple rule to follow.

[Mog]

Allowed to air an MA rated program? Sure. But content matter is still subject to FCCs guidelines, and I'm sure CN isn't wanting to have to pay any hefty fees or chance losing their license. This might help, though it is a little old.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Program Content Regulations

Cable television system operators generally make their own selection of channels and programs to be distributed to subscribers in response to consumer demands. The Commission does, however, have rules in some areas that are applicable to programming -- called "origination cablecasting" that is subject to the editorial control of the system operator. The rules generally do not apply to the contents of broadcast signals or access channels over which the system operator has no editorial control.

Cable subscribers may request a "lockbox" from cable operators to prevent viewing of any channel on which objectional programming may appear. Cable operators are required to make lockboxes available for sale or lease to customers who request them. Lockboxes can also be purchased from other commercial distributors.

The 1996 Act included several provisions that were designed to increase the subscriber's ability to control the programming coming into the home. Section 551 of the 1996 Act required representatives of the broadcast and cable television industries to develop, within one year after enactment of the 1996 Act, voluntary rules to rate programming that contains violence and sexual or other indecent material. The industry proposed the TV Parental Guidelines and the proposal was approved by the Commission on March 12, 1998. The TV Parental Guidelines (labels and content indicators and respective meanings) are:

TV-Y -- This program is designed to be appropriate for all children.

TV-Y7 -- This program is designed for children age 7 and above. Note: For those programs where fantasy violence may be more intense or more combative than other programs in this category, such programs will be designated TV-Y7-FV.

TV-G -- Most parents would find this program suitable for all ages.

TV-PG -- This program contains some material that parents may find unsuitable for younger children. The program contains one or more of the following: moderate violence (V), some sexual situations (S), infrequent coarse language (L), or some suggestive dialogue (D).

TV-14 -- This program contains some material that many parents would find unsuitable for children under 14 years of age. This program contains one or more of the following: intense violence (V), intense sexual situations (S), strong coarse language (L), or intensely suggestive dialogue (D).

TV-MA -- This program is specifically designed to be viewed by adults and therefore may be unsuitable for children under 17. This program contains one or more of the following: graphic violence (V), explicit sexual activity (S), or crude indecent language (L).

The ratings icons and associated symbols appear for 15 seconds at the beginning of all rated programming. Sports, news, commercials, promotions and unedited movies with a Motion Picture Association of America rating that are aired on premium cable channels are exempt from these ratings.
-----------------------------------------------------------------

I bolded what I believe to be the most important part. In any case, as long as the TV-MA is there they can do pretty much whatever they want, though I would assume that they wouldn't because they would be one of the first basic cable channels to fully use the privelages of the ratings system. I really don't expect that from a cartoon channel.

[Nobody You Know]

Here's a question, probably stupid:

If they go back and edit it, would that not mean that they probably should have done so in the first place?

[Conan-san]

So one could assume easily that Adult Swim is allowed to air MA rated shows now. If the TV-MA sticker takes up like 3/4 of the screen, gezze luise, as somone how lives outside the box as far as US tv is concerned that thing was blanking ridiculious during Robot Chicken.

[Youko Recca]

Here's a question, probably stupid:

If they go back and edit it, would that not mean that they probably should have done so in the first place?
Even so, we shouldn't be pointing it out so they can. People want things to come as whole as possible, making the viewing experience better. This is why alot of us are slightly pissed.

[Spongebrain2.0]

What the hell is the S&P:confused:

[Nobody You Know]

If you want a fully unadultered expirience, then most of the time, you have only one recourse:

Buy the DVDs.

It's a fact I've come to accept, and I, frankly, look for what's under the edits. If something's there, and it's good, then I normally don't care what was or wasn't cut out.

But that's me.

[livingfruitvirus]

If you want a fully unadultered expirience, then most of the time, you have only one recourse:

Buy the DVDs.

It's a fact I've come to accept, and I, frankly, look for what's under the edits. If something's there, and it's good, then I normally don't care what was or wasn't cut out.

But that's me.you must remember that most of us are cheap bastards

In response to lfv:

I don't think the problem was so much that people were talking about the episode going to be TV-MA. Instead, the bigger problem was folks pointing out reasons why it might have earned the TV-MA rating.However, nobody was pointing out potential edits in that thread.

[Karl Olson]

What the hell is the S&P:confused:


Standards and Practices. They are the people who say "That's hilarious, but we can't show that on CN!" or "That's such an awesome action shot! Pity we have to cut it out!"

[Rabi~en~Rose]

the one good I want to come of this is people who have already seen the shows to stop discussing future episodes even if the use spoiler boxes :yawn:

[Master Moron]

I don't see how strictly enforcing not talking about edits on this board is going to help when we can't restrict the official Adult Swim message board. After the Paranoia Agent incident, I made a post that informed everyone that they probably helped them edit:

http://boards.adultswim.com/adultswim/board/message?board.id=6&message.id=1629716#M1629716

Yet, everyone on that board insisted that they have other people watching the show to watch for stuff like that and them talking about it doesn't make a lick of a difference. They thought the idea that they made the edits happen was completely ridiculous. I'm not sure how prevalent the talk of this Saturday's Champloo was on that board, but it's not like people ever shut up about the content of future episodes on that board.

I'm still not sure whether or not people talking about slip-ups on message boards matter or not, I mean, it could easily be a person in the control room who notices the slip-up and informs his/her boss, and it could easily be the case where they just got cold feet about the TV-MA thing. But, if what everyone in this thread says is true and posts on message boards does lead to more edits, then it really doesn't matter how strictly we enforce the rules on this board, because unless we can get everyone on the official Adult Swim board to shut up about slip-ups and content, then they'll still edit them.

[Tienshin]

Your point is valid regarding the official AS forums, and yes, obviously we don't control what goes on over there but we do in these parts. We will have to live with that.

That said, let's not get too riled up about this. We have no certainty about how these things happen only incidents in the past that may or may not have been pure coincidence. But I think the fact remains that people want to see a product that isn't hacked to bits in the editting process, so it's best not to speculate over what may fall on the cutting room floor at all.

[Sketch]

Personally I think the only reason it was changed back to TV-14 was because it's airing at 11:30 instead of midnight (all TV-MA programming on Adult Swim has aired after midnight).

If Futurama didn't leave Adult Swim Saturdays................
There is a flaw in your logic there. Champloo was always intended to replace FMA at 11:30PM. So what you should be saying is... if Venture Bros. never left 11:30PM. Of course it's possible Inuyasha would have aired at 11:30 and Champloo at midnight but Inuyasha's addition to Saturdays was decided on after Champloo was expected to replace FMA.

[beren]

The reason I post on this forum and not the "official AS board" is because that board is filled with morons who post in bright blinking colors and that board has regulations and rules out the ass.

Listen up, we are toonzone, we are not as.com, we do not do moronic things like point out what should be eidted so it can then be edited, we are better then they are, remember that!

[PowerZord]

First on Toonami, Now On AS? Increible the ways that S&P works.

One question: I think I remenber once in my Mass media introduction class that FCC Has control over cable as well. Or maybe the books are outdated.

[Beat]

Does this mean anime will never air at TV-MA unless it's kept a secret from the world until the very minute it airs? You all act like this is the only source that they have. Believe me, if something happens, a 1000 parrots will crow on the Adultswim.com forum.

Oh, and did I mention Jefferton, the new message board personally overseen by Tim and Eric from Tom Goes to the Mayor? You don't think they'd be watched by a few S&P watchdogs?

There's always going to be someone who tells the S&P what happened, and they WILL act as quickly as they can.

[Youko Recca]

Are edit discussions all that interesting and sexy anyway? I'm sure we'd still get plenty of discussion from the episode itself. There are certain types though, like ones that we have no idea will happen but act on the other side. Like that Yusuke versus Hiei scuffle a while back, that warranted some discussion but having discussion act as a prelude isn't all that worthy. And the "slips" should be cloaked.

[livingfruitvirus]

Are edit discussions all that interesting and sexy anyway? I'm sure we'd still get plenty of discussion from the episode itself.Well obviously since all the ******bag fans have an opportunity to point their finger and beat their chest and make themselves feel big. That's pretty much all the Gundam SEED threads were while it premiered at 1 AM. Every week, just hoping for that sweet PG.

[SirLemming]

It's definitely true that we might not really make any difference considering that the AS.com boards will just spill over with a flood of morons saying moronic things no matter what. But what the heck, we might as well try.

[G1Ravage]

So what it comes down to is that originally, the good people at Adult Swim took a look at the next Champloo ep, and decided (for one reason or another) that the content presented was deserving of a TV-MA rating. Then, after someone at S&P or some such organization noticed that people here were discussing the "content" of that very ep, they looked at it again, did *something* we're not yet sure of (it could've been nothing), and the rating (at least on the schedule page) was changed to TV-14.

What this tells me is that half of the AS staff doesn't know what the other half is doing.

[Yal]

I appreciate the edit discussions (as distinct from questioning non-edits), personally. If a show I enjoy is being mangled, anything beyond language edits and the occasional splash of digital paint, I'll go rent the DVDs instead.

I can't make that decision without an edit list.

[Timmay]

So what it comes down to is that originally, the good people at Adult Swim took a look at the next Champloo ep, and decided (for one reason or another) that the content presented was deserving of a TV-MA rating. Then, after someone at S&P or some such organization noticed that people here were discussing the "content" of that very ep, they looked at it again, did *something* we're not yet sure of (it could've been nothing), and the rating (at least on the schedule page) was changed to TV-14.

What this tells me is that half of the AS staff doesn't know what the other half is doing.
I doubt the change of the TV-MA rating had to do with us. The content that you're talking about is hard to not see. They would've seen it the first time. For whatever reason they decided not to go through with the TV-MA.

[Zechs]

For the purposes of this thread, yes. Can't admin just delete said thread before it does any harm? Or are there things that prevent that?

[livingfruitvirus]

Can't admin just delete said thread before it does any harm? Or are there things that prevent that?In many cases, it's a talkback thread.

[Lord Dalek]

For the first time ever my hands are clean.

[guinaevere]

This might help, though it is a little old.
Thanks, Mog! I was completely stupid. Carry on.

[Lupin the Wolf]

Please stop using this as evidence for this argument.

The Lupin episode "My Birthday Pursuit" did not air with any edits to the visuals from the Japanese release (barring alterations made for linguistic purposes and the few requisite female nudity sequences). More info in this thread from December 2003:

http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=96386

Also of note, all the scenes shown in the previous next-episode promo were also shown in the final aired version of the episode itself, including the long shot of Lupin and Jigen running away from all the nude people in a panic.

The key item is, the "digital shorts" weren't digital, they were on the original Japanese cel art. The Japanese were the ones who panicked and added the shorts before the episode aired. Not the Americans. Thanks.

[Timmay]

Don't think anyone used that as evidence in this discussion..

[LordByronius]

I doubt the change of the TV-MA rating had to do with us. The content that you're talking about is hard to not see. They would've seen it the first time. For whatever reason they decided not to go through with the TV-MA.
Have you been purposefully ignoring every single point made by the mods in this thread?

[Lupin the Wolf]

Don't think anyone used that as evidence in this discussion..
It's in the FAQ which was quoted in the first post.

[Timmay]

Have you been purposefully ignoring every single point made by the mods in this thread? No. I've read the entire thread. All I said is that I think they chickened out of the TV-MA. Since it's about a half dozen nipple pictures that are on screen long enough for anyone that isn't blind to see, I don't see why S&P would've missed it the first time, read a thread about it, then notice it, edit it, and change the rating.

It's in the FAQ which was quoted in the first post.
sorry I didn't see that part.

[livingfruitvirus]

Speaking of this, did anyone notice last night's Aqua Teen rerun of "T-Shirt of the Living Dead" was edited?

[Karl Olson]

Speaking of this, did anyone notice last night's Aqua Teen rerun of "T-Shirt of the Living Dead" was edited?


Missed that. What was nixed from it?

[livingfruitvirus]

Missed that. What was nixed from it?Santa originally said "Those ******y elves..." but it got changed to "Those sweet little elves..."

[Master Moron]

Santa originally said "Those ******y elves..." but it got changed to "Those sweet little elves..."

Awww man...that was the funniest part of the episode. I don't even think ******y is a real adjective, which is why it's so funny. Though it just got censored out of my post...so...it must be a real word...which makes it less funny...

[G1Ravage]

Santa originally said "Those ******y elves..." but it got changed to "Those sweet little elves..."
So now AS is censoring their own shows? WTF is wrong with them? It was never wrong before, but now it is?

So much for making progress. -.-

[Karl Olson]

Santa originally said "Those ******y elves..." but it got changed to "Those sweet little elves..."

Lame, but I suppose that it was unusual that they got away with it, especially after they nixed the word fairies from "Interfection." Atleast they are making a mockery of the edit by being blantantly saccarin with replacement version. Pity that it got caught before it hit DVD though (cause given previous ATHF edits, the edit version will be the one on the disc.)

So now AS is censoring their own shows? WTF is wrong with them? It was never wrong before, but now it is?

So much for making progress. -.-

As with the aforementioned edit to ATHF in "Interfection" and given the change to Tom Goes to the Mayor to get rebirthing episode on air, it's not like AS hasn't messed with their own content before. Lets not for get the muted "Jesus" of Sweet Zombie Jesus.